Eclipse

All questions

Our design process is based on rider feedback. We read and answer all your messages. Some of them get published here so as to build a growing knowledge base.

Eclipse on NoLimitz Original Skinny or Simmer RDM10 OK?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question:  I have a Simmer x-flex (5.0) and Goya Eclipse (5.3) that rig on 400 cm mast. Any input on Simmer RDM10 vs. Goya Direct Drive for these sails? Am I missing something sailing them on my old NoLimitz “original” skinny? I’m 165’s.

Answer: Thanks for your mail and question. Simmer mast should be OK.

Nolimitz original skinny 400 is stiffer in the top, softer in the bottom than the Goya mast. This will make your sails a bit tighter in the head, and softer (flatter) in the bottom.

At your weight (165) the sail will feel ok, in light to normal wind, but will start to feel overpowered more quickly in strong wind compared to how it feels on a more flex top mast.

Flex top promotes low stable draft and progressive leech twist- this allows you to rig the sail fuller in light wind (low stable draft for power, open head for control) and allows you to add a bit of outhaul as the wind increases giving easy control when powered up (open head helps here also).

Stiff top/Soft bottom masts don’t have as much range as a flex top mast.

I am not alone with my mast bend strategy- Naish, North Sails, Ezzy, Simmer (at least when I was designing them- now I’m not sure) among others all tend towards flex top.

Hope this info helps!

Please let me know how you go.

Cheers,
Jason

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Low End on Guru G4 Similar to Banzai?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: I am a relatively light rider 157 lbs and the 84L is definitely floaty for me, so it sounds like the Banzai in a bit smaller size might work for me.  This would be my big sail for the board, so low end power is important but again something that would rotate quicker than the 5.3 Eclipse. Also I prefer a less punchy feel so I think I may prefer the newer Banzai design if its more like the 2012 Eclipse.  To me punchy is a sail with a tighter leach, like when you rig the Eclipse using the top grommet for more power, to me it feels more punchy or the COE is higher (is this what you mean by lift in the 2012 Banzai?).  I would prefer less punchy feel as long as I can get good low end power.  I hadn’t thought of the 2014 5.3 Guru maybe a possibility but in terms of low end power would that be similar to the 5.0 Banzai?

Answer: 2012 Banzai lift is from more luff curve higher in the sail. 
COE is up and back compared to 2013/14 Banzai.

5.3 Guru compared  to Banzai 5.0 is going to feel softer in the hands, because of construction.

A direct power comparison is not easy to answer directly, because it depends on other factors including the ones I explained in my last mail.

In the end, there is no %100 substitute for sail area, if there was, we would all be riding 4.5 as our biggest size!! ha ha ha

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The Banzai Flip Faster than Eclipse?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: I have a 2012 Eclipse 5.3 that I normally use on a 85L Quatro FSW but just purchased the 84L Quatro Tempo from Margaret.  Testing the board with my 5.3 I noticed the board comes around so quick compared to the FSW that I can’t flip the 5.3 quick enough.  Maybe I just need to get used to the board more but I did not notice this with a 5.0 Guru or 4.7 Northwave I tried on the board, so I think it’s the boom length of the Eclipse takes longer to rotate.  So question is would a 5.0 Banzai give similar power to the 5.3 Eclipse but rotate faster in the jibe? Any other handling character of the Banzai better suited to the Twin fin than Eclipse?  Or do you think a 5.3 Guru would work (I notice boom length is the same for Eclipse and Guru in 5.3)?

Answer: Banzai 5.0 (r 5.3) would be an interesting choice, and maybe the best choice.
For a very light, playful feel with a lot of lift- the 2012 model year is a good choice, or for a more low gear low end drive and great overall range reminiscent of the Eclipse, the 2013 or 2014 model are cut more traditionally with a low and stable and driving draft.

Yes, a 4 batten sail is generally better suited for a twin fin board.
A twin fin likes to turn quickly, and the light weight and outline plan of the 4 batten Banzai really pairs well with that maneuverable characteristic the twin has.

Guru is a consideration.
2013 and earlier Guru is 5 batten, and 2014 is 4 batten.
I would tend towards the 4 here, but know that the Guru will have a more flexible feel from the PVC window, and the outline of the sails makes it turn quickly, and the profile allows you to throw it in to neutral quickly as well.

For riders looking for a more direct feel, the Banzai is the choice.

Does a new 5.0 Banzai provide the power of a 2012 Eclipse 5.3.
If you are very light and your board is very buoyant, then answer swings towards more yes.
If you are heavier and less buoyant then more no.

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How do I reduce travel weight with Eclipse Quiver?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: At the moment i’m very happy with my 4.2/4.7/5.3 Eclipse Mod. 2012 and the Goya-Masts 3.70 / 4.00m.
One main reason for buying the sails (besides that they look great, are well built and are a pleasure to ride) was that i could use a 4.00m mast for all 3 sails, meaning that i could travel with 3 sails and two masts and still have a spare mast to safe my surfing day just in case one breaks…
 
reducing the weight of the gear is very important, as the airlines are very strict with the 30 kg max weight. On my last trip to Capetown i had to pay 200€ on overweight (on the way back we were very successful in discussing it to zero 🙂
 
so i’m a bit sad that i can’t just change to the 2014 sails, because the 5.3 (Eclipse ode Banzai) needs a 4.30 m Mast and the 4.2 needs a 3.70m. And maybe you forgot to put a vario-top in there, so i have to take 3 (!) masts (or the mix & match as recommend in your FAQ) and still don’t have a spare mast in the quiver. at the moment this keeps me from buying new 2014 eclipse or banzais…
 
are you maybe planning to reduce the luff of the 5.3 a bit and put a vario-top in the 4.2? (or maybe a ‘loop’ of this belt-material to achieve either 4.00m for travelling and 3.70m for the home spots when i got the mast in the van. As far a i know, the NP Sails have this kind of loop with an extra mast-pin that you can exchange quite easy. I’d prefer that solution, because it can’t change the length and is very light compared to a normal variop-top.)
 
what do you think?

Answer: 2014 Banzai/Eclipse sails-

4.2 to 5.3 can be covered with 4 Goya mast parts- 370 top, 400 complete, 430 bottom. 

4.2 – 400 bottom, 370 top

5.3- 430 bottom, 400 top

The 5.3 needs to be taller than 427 (maximum 400 mast + extension) for best performance. Myself, and my competitive riders don’t want to compromise performance in this critical size, and we sell what we ride and believe in.

The quality and consistency of our USA made masts allows us to mix and match length sections with confidence, and also to enhance performance characteristics of the sails.

Any more questions or comments, please let me know.

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Are Neil Pryde or Ezzy Masts OK?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: Can you give us an advice for buying sails please? First of all, my weight is about  80 kg, my boards are 2 three fin wave, 80 and 95 l ,conditions are side,side-on and onshorewind and waves of max 2 meters. I want to have 3 sails ranging from 15-37 knots. Can i use other mast than goya for example neil pryde or ezzy mast?

Answer: Ezzy mast is the closest to the Goya mast in bend. NP mast I don’t know so well.

Regarding the sails- choose according to the desired power and feel, not the conditions. All of our wave sails are suitable for any wave condition- the difference is how the sail delivers power and the feeling in your hands.

Banzai- 4 battens, light weight, direct power
Guru G4- (new for ’14) 4 battens, light weight- softer power delivery and feel
Eclipse- 5 battens, (quiet in the hands)  power and excellent overall range

Hope this info helps!

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5.7 Eclipse or 5.7 Banzai?

Archived Under Eclipse

QUESTION: I’m seriously thinking of ordering a 5.7 Banzai this weekend. Do you think I could replace my 5.7 ecplise with this? What I was thinking was just using the Banzai for super light wind gusty days to make use of its get up and go then revert to the 5.7 Eclipse when the wind picks up to make use of its higher top end and stability. A 6.1 Banzai would indeed make a very interesting proposition….

As for board size the 110 quad seems to work well on light wind days, although I am sure a 120 would be even better! Due to the nature of the conditions we get here (Tiree, Scotland) generally if there is any waves there is usually a bit of wind with it too. I am also trying to get my weight down as well…easier said than done so maybe a bigger board is the answer 😉

ANSWER: I think the 5.7 Banzai would be a great replacement for the 5.7 eclipse for you, your board and your target conditions.
Please let me know how this goes Adam, I’m very interested in your feedback here.

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Goya Eclipse vs. Simmer Icon?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: This message is for Jason Diffin. I was wondering if you could provide some insight on the Goya eclipse vs the simmer icon. I currently have the icons which I love for low wind power and upper wind control. They also have a soft feel to them when jibing , no popping of the sail from 1 tack to the next. Can you provide some feedback on the goyas and present to me why they are better then simmer. I am a little concerned with the goyas fatter head with upper wind sail flutter and range vs the icon. I weigh around 185 or so and use my sails for freestyle, some waves and bump and jump.

Answer: I can’t comment directly on the Simmer Icon, because I didn’t design that sail. I can only speak with authority on the sails I have designed.

Also, I’m not sure if the Icon head is smaller than the Eclipse…
Regardless, we don’t have any problems with leech flutter on any of the eclipse sizes.

Eclipse is a 5 batten power wave sails that offers excellent stability throughout a wide wind range. Foil is cut both horizontally and vertically in the sail which gives a nice blend of fixed shape low and a flexible shape in the mid/forward area. There is no hard pop from tack to tack on the Eclipse sail.

We also offer the sail Banzai, and considering that you mention freestyle, the 4 batten Banzai is a very light feeling, powerful and playful sail- maybe one worth considering for you.
2012 Banzai offers a very lifty lightweight feel that goes well in the low to mid wind range, particularly on higher volume boards, and the 2013 Banzai is a more rangy sail with a lower more forward driving draft that provides excellent high wind control.

Where are you sailing mostly David? The reason I ask is that the best way to make such an important purchase is to try before you buy… Perhaps we could organize a demo for you…

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Will banzai work better than eclipse in stronger winds with more emphazis on comfortable ride and jumping than wavesailing?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: My quiver is Guru 4.2, Eclipse 4,7, 5,3, 5,7.

I am using 4,2 only in hi wind and not for waves. I do waveriding in Mauricius in lo wind with 4,7 to 5,7 sails so i travel without 4,2.

We were talking on Maui in 2009 and you suggested me Guru for hi wind and 4,7 eclipse and the compo is superb only i am lacking some power from guru when the wind is gusty. I have 200 lbs and i am using 4,2 only in winds around 40 knotts and more. I would like to take either eclipse 4,2 or banzai 4,2. Will banzai work better than eclipse in stronger winds with more emphazis on comfortable ride and jumping than wavesailing?

Answer: 

I think the 2013 Banzai 4.2 would be a very interesting sail for you- it has a great low power (more power than Guru 4.2) and excellent high wind control as well. With 4 battens and a lighter construction than your Guru 4.2, it feels super nice in hands- in a straight line or in transitions, jumps, etc…

I also think that you would really like the Banzai in the larger sizes as well- 4.7, 5.3 and 5.7. Particularly because these are your key wave riding sizes- the ’13 Banzai compared to Eclipse is a whole new world of easy handling and quick maneuvering in the surf…

Hope this info helps!!

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Should I change from Eclipse to Banzai?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: I use the 2011 Eclipse (5,3; 4,7; 4,2) and I am thinking about changing to the 2012 Banzai (4,9; 4,3; 3,9). Do you think that the Banzai makes sense in European conditions? I (69 kg) will use it on my lovely 72 quad and on my new freestyle 99 (it looks really great!). Thanks and greetz from Germany!you will love the BANZAI in sizes 4.9 and 4.3 for sure. The sails are so light and responsive and powerful. For really maxed out conditions where control is key, then it’s hard to beat the stability of a 5 batten sail. So, for your smallest size in the quiver you describe, I actually think a GURU 3.7 would be a great choice. That sail has great power, plus the pvc window and profile characteristic of the sail are very forgiving and comfortable in a huge wind range including over- powered conditions. GURU 2012 is lighter weight and lighter feeling, with a more effortless and responsive handling characteristic. If you don’t like the softer feeling of PVC, then ECLIPSE is the next choice. For 2012 Eclipse is also lighter weight and lighter feeling than previous versions. So, for the smallest size the choice is up to you. Personally I like the comfort and control of GURU in radical conditions, but if you like your sails more direct feeling, then go for ECLIPSE. 3.9 Banzai is still a pretty powerful sail, so my feeling is that as you move in to the high end wind range your focus should be on control, and that’s where the 5 batten 3.7 models come in to play. I hope this info helps you Heiko! Kind Regards, Jason Diffin

Answer: you will love the BANZAI in sizes 4.9 and 4.3 for sure. The
sails are so light and responsive and powerful.

For really maxed out conditions where control is key, then it’s hard
to beat the stability of a 5 batten sail.

So, for your smallest size in the quiver you describe, I actually
think a GURU 3.7 would be a great choice. That sail has great power,
plus the pvc window and profile characteristic of the sail are very
forgiving and comfortable in a huge wind range including over-
powered conditions.

GURU 2012 is lighter weight and lighter feeling, with a more
effortless and responsive handling characteristic.

If you don’t like the softer feeling of PVC, then ECLIPSE is the
next choice. For 2012 Eclipse is also lighter weight and lighter
feeling than previous versions.

So, for the smallest size the choice is up to you.

Personally I like the comfort and control of GURU in radical
conditions, but if you like your sails more direct feeling, then go
for ECLIPSE.

3.9 Banzai is still a pretty powerful sail, so my feeling is that as
you move in to the high end wind range your focus should be on
control, and that’s where the 5 batten 3.7 models come in to play.

I hope this info helps!

Kind Regards,
Jason Diffin

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Can 2012 4.9 Banzai replace my 5.7 Eclipse?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: Apparently the largest size available is a 4.9 Banzai and I was wondering if that be equal to a 5.7 Eclipse on a 95L Quatro Quad? I’d love to go as small a sail as possible, but not sure if the 4.9 will cut it for me. Even though I am 210lbs, I am an efficient sailor; often on the same sail size as lighter guys (say ~170-180lbs guys). The 5.7 2011 eclipse (monofilm version) I have now gets me going in mid teens (mph) winds. Too bad I didn’t get a change to try the sail last weekend, but I am sure you have a good idea if it will work for me or not. Also, would you think going all Banzai will work for me, or is the Eclipse Mono a more appropriate sail for me here in the Bay Area. Reading the 2012 brochure, it sounds like the 2012 sails are even lighter and more powerful than the 2011s??? Maybe do a 4.9 Banzai and then 5.0/4.5/4.0 Eclipse Mono?!

Answer: Basically with the Banzai sail- IF you have enough volume under your feet, then the Banzai power equals that of an Eclipse or Guru that is .5 meters larger. There is no way the Banzai 4.9 will replace the power of an Eclipse 5.7 for you.

But not to worry, the new Eclipse is a nice improvement over last year’s sail.
The construction is lighter, and the cut is a little different in that there is more lower leech release- this will help give the sails a lighter feeling, and an overall better better handling and high end speed.

The power level from 2011 to 2012 is not more, but is refined to create a lighter feeling better handling sail.

Regarding larger sizes Banzai- they are in the works, but at the moment I am only approving up to 4.9…
Stay tuned on that one, because as I work out those larger sizes, bigger guys like you will be top of the list for testing…!!!

Cheers Arnie!

JD

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How is Banzai positioned vis a vis Guru & Eclipse?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: The new 2012 looks stunning, simple and nice. Just needs a little help to position the Banzai in relation to Guru and Eclipse. In my mind I have Guru as very controleable high wind sail, easy to depower, fast. Not so good at early planning and cross on conditions Eclipse is power wave sail, with early planning and good with cross on conditions. A very attractive euro wave sail. Not so good at speed and controle in owerpowered conditions. So now to – where is Banzai better than Guru / Eclipse and where is it less recomended?

Answer: Thanks for your mail and inquiry.

I would tend to disagree regarding your comment about GURU-

Not so good at early planning and cross on conditions”
GURU is a quickly neutral sail, that’s for sure, but the sail also has a a good low end punch.
Also, I never really classify the sails according to conditions, but rather by the feeling and power delivery you are looking for in any given condition.
GURU works well in onshore conditions, if you like a quickly neutral, flexible feeling sail.
Alternatively, ECLIPSE is a great sail for cross offshore down the line wave riding if your preference is a quick and direct feeling sail.

Moving on to the new 4 batten sail BANZAI 2012-

Here’s my basic summary of the sail-

Currently the size range is 3.3, 3.6, 3.9, 4.3, 4.6, 4.9.
The spacing between sizes is larger than standard because the range of the sail is larger than standard.
That larger range inhabits the low end performance of the sail.
This 4 batten sail is meant to be used about .5 smaller than you would normally choose in models Guru and Eclipse. For example 4.9 replaces 5.3, 4.6 replaces 5.0, 4.3 replaces 4.5/(4.7).
***These sails are NOT meant to be used over powered. If it gets windier, you size down.
***These 4 batten sails are best paired with a modern, high volume board that gets moving quickly.
The profile of these sails is relatively flat, but very “engaged” from the bottom to the top. The entire sail is cut to generate lift everywhere. This is why it’s possible to use a smaller size. Also, the extreme light weight of the sail amplifies the lift. The super light weight plus relatively flat profile of the sail contributes to an effortless handling characteristic in maneuvers and just sailing along…

This 4 batten sail features an aspect ratio very similar to the 5 batten sails (the 4 batten 4.6 is 162/413), but considering that you use a size smaller than a 5 batten sail, you end up with the benefit of the shorter boom and luff comparatively.
I don’t believe that 4 batten sails should be too short in the luff dimension. If you shorten the height too much, then you are forced to extend the boom, the leech outline, or both. A square meter is a square meter after all, no matter how you draw it.
By minimizing the trailing outline of the sail the 4 batten maintains a very quiet feeling in the hands at all points of sail.

The power delivery of this sail is smooth and accelerating, and the feeling is a comfortable combination of direct and flexible.

Our 5 batten models GURU and ECLIPSE are a better choice for sailors looking for more high end range, and a lower locked and forward driving power delivery.
A couple of words regarding GURU and ECLIPSE-

ECLIPSE 2012 will still be a full power direct wave sail, but with a lighter, stronger construction, combined with a more forward driving, light feeling handling characteristic.

GURU 2012 also will be lighter and stronger. GURU 2012 will have great low end power and improved maneuverability in wave riding and transitions due to increased lower leech twist and a modified foot outline.

I hope this info helps Lars!
Please don’t hesitate to ask if you have any more questions…

Cheers

JD

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Ezzy Hookipa Skinny on 2011 Eclipse?

Archived Under Eclipse

Questions: Hope all is well. I just received my 2011 Goya Eclipses-5.7 / 5.3 / 4.7 4.2 sooo stoked I currently have 2 masts, Ezzy Hookipa skinny, 1 is 430-21 and the other is 400-19 Just a few questions. Does the 5.3 Eclipse take 400-19 ? And can I get by with my Ezzy Hookipa skinnies? 2010 / 2009 models I guess I could sell the Ezzy-400-19 and buy a Goya 400-19, since the Goya 400- will cover me for 5.3 & 4.7 , but I saw in Boardseeker sail test that you recommended Ezzy as best alternative mast Most likely I will buy a Goya 370 /17 for 4.2 Mahalo for feedback / advice

Answer: Stoked to hear you got the new gear.

The 5.3 Eclipse requires a 400 mast.
Your Ezzy 400/19 should be OK!

The difference with the new Goya masts is that we have modified the lay-up of the masts to increase the durability, and the layup change also improved the feel of the masts.

Please feel free to contact me any time with feedback or questions John!

Happy Holidays

JD

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How do I best rig my Eclipse?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: I’d say I am struggling a wee bit to rig the Eclipse properly.  I downhaul to what appears to be just twist to the mark, kinda not wanting to apply too much to max out the power.  I am using a Gulftech carbon extension at 24cm – to the max gives what what appears to be leech flop in the top panel to the tuning mark.  Anyway, it seems that when I apply just enough outhaul to keep the sail from touching the boom while sailing, there is a lot of funkiness around the 1 & 2 batten (or, the bottom one and one above the boom).  It seems that the sail seems loosey goosey around there.  I think I have enough tension on the battens, and don’t want to over-tighten.  Does that sound to you like a symptom of not enough downhaul?

Answer: A 24cm base extension is not going to be enough. All Goya sails are designed with a 28-30cm extension capability in mind (the space distance between mast lengths).
24 is a very short max extension.

You need the full 27 that is prescribed for that sail, otherwise you will run in to the problems you describe below.
Don’t be afraid of killing the power in the sail with too much downhaul. Even in very light wind it is important to get your sail twisting properly to be efficient.

Power is controlled with the outhaul.
I normally don’t describe the outhaul setting by describing how the sail touched the boom, because that can vary greatly depending on the boom type, and also the mast bend characteristics.

What you want to look for, is with the sail properly downhauled, 1cm of positive tension will provide max power. 3cm of positive tension will create a flatter, more neutral feeling sail.

– Jason D.

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Does the 2011 5.3 Eclipse work with a 430?

Archived Under Eclipse

Question: Does the 2011 5.3 Eclipse run on the 430 mast as well or does it require a 400 mast? Also wondering how the 2011 Eclispe works on the no limitz (91% carbom rdm wave mast (particularly interested in the low wind aspect)?

Answer: 5.3 Eclipse requires 400 mast, or 400/430 combo- preferably 400 bottom, 430 top.

I don’t recommend any of the stock Nolimitz masts for our sails, except for 340 in very rare cases.

The quality of the Nolimitz mast is unquestionable, it’s just the stiff tip that kills the compatibility with our sails.

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